Friday, July 24, 2009

3216 Tyrol - Pricing difficulties up in Top of World


I noticed 3216 Tyrol in the MLS - it is a house with Irvine views (no ocean) up in the Top of the World neighborhood. I like this neighborhood because it seems to be family friendly and is flat. The Tyrol house has been for sale since 2007 at various prices, I think from above $3,000,000 to just below $2,000,000. Just like many other Laguna Beach home prices, this one should be treated with a lot of caution.

It is hidden pretty well in the online listings, but this home's prior sale price was about $2,000,000 in 2006 - a prime bubble year. Notably, the home's owners appear to be real estate agents and I wonder how the prior sale data has been kept out of the MLS (redfin) and Zillow databases? Suspicious. Now that home values in Laguna Beach have retreated, in my opinion, to 2003 or so, this home's asking price is WAY overstated. I'd take 20%-30% off of the $2,000,000 prior sale price to arrive at today's value. I don't think this attempted home flip is going to work very well for the owners.

I've been in the house and it has great Irvine (meaning everything that is non-ocean for miles and miles) views, but its a duplex - the interior is chopped up and it just feels like a small house. The kitchen is small for an expensive house and there is a narrow, one bedroom unit on the first floor that isn't really usable for much other than renting. On the other hand it has great deck space, a huge garage, but no pool.

Update: This home has been withdrawn from the market.
Thoughts?

22 comments:

Anonymous said...

It is not all bad news. From the Register:

Just one Orange County city — Laguna Beach — was among the top 10in the state for single-family median sale prices in June. The 10 were: Beverly Hills, $1,775,000; Manhattan Beach, $1,475,000; Burlingame, $1,475,000; Los Altos, $1,398,000; Saratoga, $1,375,000; Laguna Beach, $1,265,000; Palo Alto, $1,192,000; Santa Monica, $1,022,000; Cupertino, $1,020,000; Mill Valley, $1,009,000; and Los Gatos, $857,500.

Anonymous said...

LB is definitely starting to show some cracks. Tons of sub-$1 million listings. Winter will be dark for property owners there.

Anonymous said...

The sub-$1 million listing are 2 bed 1 bath cottages that would be worth 300k inland.

Laguna and Newport are among the best places to live in the OC, and price will always reflect that.

Anonymous said...

Those listings under $1 million are also snapped up pretty quickly, if they are over 1000 sq. ft.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, you mean like the piece of crap that this place is?

http://www.redfin.com/search#lat=33.54836201298741&long=-117.77505437286933&market=socal&max_price=1000000&num_beds=3&region_id=9948&region_type=6&status=1&uipt=1&v=5&zoomLevel=11

No wait, that's a gorgeous place with a full view of the ocean completely upgraded, 2000 square feet for $875K.

You must be an LB owner, I pity you. How does it feel to know in your heart of hearts that you'll be breathing through a straw for the next ten years you're so under water?

Anonymous said...

All of OC Real Estate is down from the peak. Don't pity all Laguna property owners though. From the register:

Just 12.6% of of the 10,071 homes in Laguna Beach will have values cut or unchanged this year.
As of Jan. 1 — the tax assessment date — Laguna Beach home values had fallen just 8.3%, compared to a 30% drop countywide.

Anonymous said...

I wish I could live in Laguna Beach, but I don't. That house you posted is a short sale up in Arch Beach Heights. It will be snapped up soon, if it hasn't been already. But since it's a SS we probably won't know for a while.

Anonymous said...

Projections are for the high end areas to drop 40% compared to the 30% of lower-priced areas. Short sales sell because they're priced at the bottom of the market. As the market is flooded with high-end defaults, these will continue the market plummet. Good days are ahead for buyers. Arrogant owners are in for a real attitude adjustment.

Anonymous said...

Oh wait! Here's another gorgeous house with 3BR/3BA and listed for $889,000 and $370/square foot. But, it must be an exception of some kind. I mean, Laguna Beach prices could never go down, could they? Of course, this one's not as close to the beach as the rest of Laguna Beach. That must be it. Nothing any closer will drop though. I'm sure of it, just as sure as I was when I thought LB would never go down.

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Laguna-Beach/976-Santa-Ana-St-92651/home/4899572

Anonymous said...

You are talking about Arch beach heights. I grew up there, the neighborhood is a glorified slum. Santa ana street la mirada, street katella, huge roof rats, thin walls,grow houses, lots of drugs, losers and deadbeats. No ammount of surface cosmetics will change that. ABH is not Emerald bay.

Anonymous said...

According to redfin, LB had approx. 50 houses over 1 million dollars close in the last three months.

Find an example of a nice size house in good condition, not in Arch Beach Heights, that is under 1mill.

If you can, buy it!

Anonymous said...

You grew up in a slum? You must be ashamed of your parents. Did they not have jobs?

So it used to be that CA real estate would never go down. Then, it was that only the inland areas were vulnerable. Then, it was only the bad neighborhoods like Santa Anna. Never the beachside towns. Then it was Laguna Beach. Now it's only certain parts of Laguna beach. Oh, and the parts that are more reasonably priced are just slums. Laguna beach only includes Emerald Bay.

The tide's coming in and its lapping at your toes. But, of course, it won't come any higher, right? No areas are immune, they're all connected by the substitution effect. It's trickling up every day and the last to fall will fall the hardest.

Anonymous said...

I will name you one that will not fall. 92661. Newport Beach. That zip is the only neighborhood of true wealth. There has not been one foreclosure there. Most all other parts of OC ,Laguna,Dana,Huntington, are all middle class neighborhoods but with a case of SERIOUS class envy!

Anonymous said...

At this later date Realtytrac reports there are 16 foreclosures in 92661, which is the peninsula, and there are hundreds in other parts of Newport Beach.

Anonymous said...

Please stop talking bad about this house! My friend happens to live there and it's a beautifull house! That price is really worth it! It's a 3 level house with an elevator. And before you talk bad about it you should go see it.

Mr. Blue said...

To the last poster. Come on.
I have been in the house.
I stand by my comments.
It does not stand up well to the homes available in the $2M price range in Laguna Beach. No ocean view.

Finally, why is pointing out that the house sold at the peak of the market for $2,000,000 saying "something bad?" It happens to be the truth. Apparently hiding the truth would be preferrable to you so some buyers get hoodwinked into believing this is a "good deal?"
Get some ethics. Then again, you must be a real estate agent - I can tell......

Anonymous said...

I lived in Laguna 1970-85
i'm ready to move back with the family.We vacation in laguna 2 months a year.
We've been locked and loaded,ready to buy for the last 18 months.
The news about calif that we see in Chicago couldn't be worse.
the income tax hit to move back to calif would be considerable.
we track all the listings, see every transaction, and look at houses in the neighborhoods we are interested in while we're there.
In my humble opinion, prices are a looong way from the bottom,both in terms of price and time. There hasn't been a seller capitulation from the hysterical runup after 2003
I will buy, but it's going to take a HECK of deal to seperate me from my money.

chrissie said...

BLUE MOVE your are an idiot and you have no idea what you are talking about. Example, the mere fact you use the abbreviation WTF. This home has not been for sale since 2003. It was purchased in 2006, COMPLETELY renovated right up to the roof and is being sold under value. I, the owner (a hotel owner who also has a real estate license) is relocating, I am not flipping. if I was flipping I would be trying to make more than I paid for it. The house is not "Choppy" it is multi level, as are more than 1/2 of Laguna Beach's homes. There is a dynamic view from every room. You have NEVER set foot in my home, you are lying to your blogee's. The home has ALL NEW top end appliances. You really need to get a life and find something to do with yourself. I sure hope you don't have a real estate license because I am going to report you to the DRE. Your tactics violate DRE ethics laws.

chrissie said...

Blue Move, your quote:” and I wonder how the prior sale data has been kept out of the databases? Suspicious." is fiction, and implies dishonesty and you proceed to add a link to my website. You abbriviate profanity...not professional or ethical.
The fact of the matter is, if you truly did your homework on this one, you would find the prior sales data is QUITE PUBLIC. The previous sale was $2,050,000 and there is NO mortgage. What is suspicious about that? If you have really been to my home you would see the view is NOT all Irvine. It is a 360 degree direct Saddleback Mountain view and Aliso Viejo, Niguel and the entire Orange County Valley can be seen...all the way to San Bernardino. The bottom floor (4th floor) is quite functional. It is a (permitted) separate entranced guest studio with a 10 X 5 walk in steam shower, granite kitchen and a 360 degree view which gets $1,000 a month in rent, with 100% occupancy. Half of your blog entries about Laguna Beach homes are assumptions and convoluted fiction. you are not very credible. What Starbucks do you work out of?

Mr. Blue said...

Dear Anon who likes the 92661 (Newport). The latest dataquick numbers show that this zip code median price is down 43.5%. GULP. But, no, it could never go down, right? Must be a misprint. NOT.

Mr. Blue said...

Chrissie, my goodness the fur is flying!

"Chopped up" ?? Perhaps I got that feeling because the place is, as you admit, a duplex, not a stand alone 4000 square foot house, which would feel more connected, at least to me. The decks are super because of the inland views. This is my opinion.

The kitchen may have new appliances that cost $10k or so, but it is narrow and I don't recall it even having an island. It has nice views. Again, I'm just sayin.

Yes, by saying "Irvine views (no ocean)" I meant that the property has views of everything but the ocean. Excuse me for not elaborating on all the cities and mountains one can see. No ocean view means there is no property value premium that would come from an ocean view - other than beach proximity, that is the most important thing in Laguna Beach, wouldn't you agree?

On the prior sale - it doesn't show up in the MLS data available on Redfin.com - it doesn't show up on Zillow.com, either. I don't know how the average person would know about the prior sale - if you know, let me know.

I do try to find out the facts and put them in the blog. I wish you the best in selling your home - but if no one bites at $2M after a long time, I would think that most agents in town would simply tell you that it needs to be marked down. That is not hard to figure out and it's not an unreasonable or unethical conclusion.
Thanks.

Eric Allen Bell said...

3216 Tyrol Drive, Laguna Beach, CA 92651

OWNER: Mian Situ

This is a warning to anyone who is considering buying or renting this house. My comments will address both the disastrous condition of the house itself and what I believe to be the sociopathic nature of its owner, Mian Situ.

PROPERTY: This is a 4 story luxury home in the hills of Laguna Beach.

Some of the problems I personally had to spend thousands of dollars to fix and others will cost a small fortune to fix. Specifically?

- The entire East wing of the house has no air conditioning at all and no heater. This is a problem for a number of reasons, one of which is that the back of the house is nearly all giant glass windows. When it is even remotely sunny out, the East half of the house becomes unbearably hot. When it is not a warm day, the East half of the house becomes very cold. Because of the windows and high ceilings, area heaters are useless. And plugging in area heaters will cause the electricity to have a shortage and go out. Mian Situ refuses to fix this.

- The electrical system throughout the house was done on the cheap and lightbulbs often burn out after only 2-3 days. Mian Situ refuses to fix this.

- Elevator. The elevator cable was not installed properly. According to an elevator technician, no one should use the elevator as the cable is ready to break, sending the elevator and those riding in it into a catastrophic fall. Mian Situ refuses to fix this.

- Main balcony. Because the house was built on the side of a hill, and the foundation appears to be a problem, the balcony is slanted slightly downward. Not only does this look bad, but it seems to indicate that the house may be slowly drooping downward. I don?t know the cost of fixing this, but it would appear to be a major overhaul as the house is 4 stories and approximately 5,000 square feet. Mian Situ told me this is cost prohibitive to fix.

- Entry way: To get to the front door, one must walk down a steep flight of stairs. These stairs or quite slippery when the fog rolls in. Because of the altitude, that is nearly every morning. Furthermore, because of what Mian Situ calls a ?problem with Lyme? the paint on the walls, all the way down, is peeling badly. And simply repainting it will not solve the problem, as water and mold are seeping through the concrete and destroying those walls. A fresh coat of paint will only hide this for a short while. We brought this to Mian Situ?s attention, but he indicated it is too expensive to fix.

- Entire bottom floor. I lost consciousness and was taken to the hospital in an ambulance, due to lack of ventilation and poor air quality. The room where the sewage pump is located is next to the main room and comingles with the air conditioning and heating for that floor. Because of a constant leak in the sump pump (this after I spent thousands of dollars to replace this pump) sewage air blows into the vents, thus rendering the downstairs office a serious and expensive safety hazard.

OWNER: Mian Situ

- We recently took legal action, broke our lease and moved out as the house was not safe to inhabit. Mr. Situ forced us to vacate for an extended period of time, while he attempted to fix some rather severe problems with the foundation of the house. I don?t believe those problems were adequately fixed. Because the house was a danger to my children, we broke our lease, at a considerable financial loss to my family.

- It is my personal opinion that Mr. Situ knowingly and willfully misrepresented how badly the house had been neglected. Based on the opinions of contractors and other specialists, who examined the house at our request, I believe this house will be a money pit for whomever ends up buying or leasing it. And I consider it my moral obligation to warn the next residents of the problems that I was not warned of.